The Nintendo Next Gen system is real and has a name... NX

Laer_HeiSeiRyuu

Well-Known Member
Again, Nintendo is NOT going to waste money to develop a game on Wii U right now. Not happening !!! The game that are going to be released on Wii U now, are games that have been already in development for some time. If we hear about a Next Level or Retro game coming on Wii U this year, it's because the game was already in production for at least 2 years ! Square Enix !!! Really ? Seriously, come on son :)


I'm not sure with the release dates, so you are saying the following :
- NX Reveal 2016
- NX release window unveiled in September 2016
- NX actual release date October / November 2017
If that's what you meant, I have to disagree...

Nowadays, time to market has to be faster ! The competition is reacting quickly. And in a social media era, leaks are happening more frequently, so it's even harder to maintain innovation. Revealing NX at E3 2016, but releasing it late 2017, would leave too much time to the competition to react and too much opportunity for 3rd party devs to leaks info on NX ( especially if Nintendo has a killer ap ).

So, IMO, NX will be unveiled and released the same year, as it was the case for the PS4 and the Xbox One ( and the 3DS is some capacity as it was released just 8 months after its reveal ). I still believe it will be in 2016.
They didnt say they'd unveil it, they said they'd talk more about it. The 3DS has a lot of third party support lined up for 2016 so I think the successor is coming in early 2017. The Wii U successor I feel will release fall 2017.

I think that while EAD is probably developing the next core mainline mario game for the NX, their other studios ( like Retro and Next Level games) have one more Wii U game in the wait. the rest of it will be partnership collabs they inted to release on the Wii U. ( Like say an HD remake of the fatal frame games, and maybe a Fire Emblem Path of Radiance/Radiant Dawn pack).

Remember they gotta wait for the ARM tech to be ready.
 
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Goodtwin

Well-Known Member
I too believe there is more in the pipeline than we know about, and they wont all be small scale games. Nintendo has a lot of teams at EAD, so while I do believe that pretty much any game just beginning development will likely target the NX, there should be quite a few gems still coming. Nintendo could, and probably should, fatten up the lineup for Wii U over the next couple years by doing HD remasters of popular games. Its kind of a two for one deal, not only can they sell the remaster for $50 on the Wii U, but then down the road they have those remasters all ready to go for the NX eshop. Keep in mind that Nintendo still has a pretty good relationship with many of the Japanese studios, so with teams such as Tecmo/Koei, there is plenty of potential there for more collaborations.
 

Odo

Well-Known Member
Stuff like that makes an ARM console even more viable:

http://www.pocketgamer.co.uk/r/Android/Final+Fantasy+XIII/news.asp?c=64783

Gamers in Japan can now play Final Fantasy XIII on iOS or Android, thanks to a cloud-based service that streams the game to their phone or tablet.

Like OnLive or PlayStation Now, this monster console RPG is actually being played on a server somewhere in Japan and the footage is sent to your device. In return, you send controller inputs back over the air.

Square Enix recommends that you only play if you're on a wi-fi network and have a stable 3Mbps connection.

Plus, you get a free half an hour trial to see if the game works well on your connection. After that runs out it'll cost you 2000 Yen (about £11 / $16) for unlimited access to the game.

No word on whether this service will be available in the US or Europe. But if it did arrive over here, would you buy a game that's not actually running on your phone?
 

Ex-Actarus

Well-Known Member
Let's NOT forget, AMD has 2 design wins : 1 for ARM and the other one of X86. Could the ARM be for the 3DS successor and X86 for the Wii U successor ? If so, which one if the NX ? The Handheld or the home console ?

I'm starting to believe that NX will be a something like the Nvidia Shield, a portable device that will allow to play on TV, so basically a home console as well.
 

Shoulder

Your Resident Beardy Bear
Let's NOT forget, AMD has 2 design wins : 1 for ARM and the other one of X86. Could the ARM be for the 3DS successor and X86 for the Wii U successor ? If so, which one if the NX ? The Handheld or the home console ?

I'm starting to believe that NX will be a something like the Nvidia Shield, a portable device that will allow to play on TV, so basically a home console as well.
I could see that, but the form factor is one thing Nintendo would have to take into account. But, we also know Iwata specifically said a "hybrid" system was not going to happen, at least not for a long while. As far as designs AMD has, it could go either way. Maybe Nintendo will in fact go for x86 for the console, and ARM for the handheld. But it would still baffle me that they would forego all their other previous knowledge for something completely different. But that also being said, Sony did it with the PS4, and they're doing quite well so far.

The ARM for handheld, and x86 for console was something that did cross my mind, but I just don't see x86 fitting into Nintendo's philosophy (with low-power, and small form factor). But here's another thing though: we know nothing of the AMD designs, so maybe they are designed to work together, and that would make cross-development much easier than it is now with the 3DS and Wii U.
 

Ex-Actarus

Well-Known Member
I could see that, but the form factor is one thing Nintendo would have to take into account. But, we also know Iwata specifically said a "hybrid" system was not going to happen, at least not for a long while. As far as designs AMD has, it could go either way. Maybe Nintendo will in fact go for x86 for the console, and ARM for the handheld. But it would still baffle me that they would forego all their other previous knowledge for something completely different. But that also being said, Sony did it with the PS4, and they're doing quite well so far.

The ARM for handheld, and x86 for console was something that did cross my mind, but I just don't see x86 fitting into Nintendo's philosophy (with low-power, and small form factor). But here's another thing though: we know nothing of the AMD designs, so maybe they are designed to work together, and that would make cross-development much easier than it is now with the 3DS and Wii U.
My concern with ARM design is the power is it going to be powerful enough for a next gen console ? To put things prospective, the PS3 was 10 times more powerful than the PS2 ; and the PS4 is 10 times more powerful than the PS3. So I'm not saying the NX ( if it's a home console ) should be 10 times more powerful than the PS4, that would not make sense and it would not be possible anyway at a 300$/350$ price. But The NX needs to be significantly more powerful than the Ps4. Could a ARM design deliver that for a home console ? I'm not sure...

That's why the X86 makes sense for me on the home console front. So here maybe a possibility :

2016 ( Reveal E3 2016 )
- NX Handheld console ( powered by ARM processor )
- Slightly more powerful than the Wii U
- Streaming feature allowing you to play on the big screen
- Compatible with the Wii U pro controller and the Gamepad
- Compatible with Mobile games
- HD Screen ( probably 720p )

2017 ( Reveal TGS 2016 )
- NX Home console ( powered by X86 processor )
- Significantly more powerful than the PS4
- 4K and VR capable
- Cloud features
- Some kind of PC integration
 

Juegos

All mods go to heaven.
Moderator
But The NX needs to be significantly more powerful than the Ps4.
I really don't see this. The PS4 and Xbone aren't all that much more powerful than the PS3 and X360, and devs are happy making games with those limitations in mind. It's not like devs are being held back all that much by the current hardware, certainly not in two years from now. Games and developers aren't ambitious enough to require that extra horsepower you think the NX needs. Nintendo least of them all.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
I really don't see this. The PS4 and Xbone aren't all that much more powerful than the PS3 and X360, and devs are happy making games with those limitations in mind. It's not like devs are being held back all that much by the current hardware, certainly not in two years from now. Games and developers aren't ambitious enough to require that extra horsepower you think the NX needs. Nintendo least of them all.
Bull fucking shit.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
Make it as powerful as the PS5, have extensive marketing to appeal to the working class audience that mostly plays mature games, get similar 3rd party support, and basically, just follow the competition this time.

If it's a handheld, then whatever.
 

EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
Yeah, especially if the NX starts off in handheld form, don't expect it to be a spec monster. You'd need to actually hold the thing, which kinda rules out PS4 power.
To put things prospective, the PS3 was 10 times more powerful than the PS2 ; and the PS4 is 10 times more powerful than the PS3.
You remember when Sony posted this pic?



They said the PS4 was 43 times more powerful. ...than the PS2. (Probably relying on the megahertz myth, no less.)

Not the PS3. Why? Well, as Extreme Tech notes: "In case you were wondering, depending on how you look at it, the PS4 is only marginally more powerful than the PS3."

The PS3 was orders of magnitude more powerful than the PS2. nVidia hinted at it being 50 times more powerful. That was probably a bit of boasting on a particularly useless benchmark, but it probably wasn't terribly far off (perhaps in the 35x neighborhood), either. The power bump from PS3 to PS4 was not as dramatic.
I really don't see this. The PS4 and Xbone aren't all that much more powerful than the PS3 and X360, and devs are happy making games with those limitations in mind. It's not like devs are being held back all that much by the current hardware, certainly not in two years from now. Games and developers aren't ambitious enough to require that extra horsepower you think the NX needs. Nintendo least of them all.
Bull fucking shit.
Nope, he's right.

http://www.theguardian.com/technolo...ox-one-so-why-arent-they-backwards-compatible

"The second piece of bad news is performance headroom. To emulate an old system's hardware in software you need a system which is significantly more powerful, I'd say ten times more powerful is a good rule of thumb. This current generation is simply not that much more powerful than the last, especially in terms of general purpose compute. Moore's law is basically over for CPUs, and has been for around five years. That means new machines do not have the power to emulate last generation in software."

Not even 10 times more powerful this gen (which has been about the power chasm other people actually using the hardware have said). I've posted this quite a few times. I don't know why people think they know more about videogame hardware than Martin Hollis, but I'm trusting him, not anonymous random flop counters on the intertoobz.
 
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Goodtwin

Well-Known Member
It was a double whammy with the jump from PS3/360 to PS4/X1, not only does the law of diminishing returns apply, but they simply didnt use high end hardware like they did the previous gen. Microsoft was losing a lot of money on the 360 back in 2005, and Sony did with the PS3 in 2006. These new consoles were developed using tech that had been around for years in the PC arena, and would be capable of selling with little to no loss for less money than the PS3 launched for back in 2006. With the 360 and PS3, you were getting more than you paid for, but thats a bad business practice and both Sony and Microsoft figured that out. Not to mention that publishers were complaining about the long life cycle of those consoles. They were ready to move on, but Sony and Microsoft were still recouping losses from early on.

The fact that many publishers are still creating games that play on both current and last gen consoles should be reason enough to understand that the chasm between last gen and current gen is narrow compared to the transitions in the past.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
You remember when Sony posted this pic?



They said the PS4 was 42 times more powerful. ...than the PS2.

Not the PS3. Why? Well, as Extreme Tech notes: "In case you were wondering, depending on how you look at it, the PS4 is only marginally more powerful than the PS3."

The PS3 was orders of magnitude more powerful than the PS2. nVidia hinted at it being 50 times more powerful. That was probably a bit of boasting on a particularly useless benchmark, but it probably wasn't terribly far off, either. The power bump from PS3 to PS4 was not as dramatic.

Nope, he's right.

http://www.theguardian.com/technolo...ox-one-so-why-arent-they-backwards-compatible

"The second piece of bad news is performance headroom. To emulate an old system's hardware in software you need a system which is significantly more powerful, I'd say ten times more powerful is a good rule of thumb. This current generation is simply not that much more powerful than the last, especially in terms of general purpose compute. Moore's law is basically over for CPUs, and has been for around five years. That means new machines do not have the power to emulate last generation in software."

Not even 10 times more powerful this gen (which has been about the power chasm other people actually using the hardware have said). I've posted this quite a few times. I don't know why people think they know more about videogame hardware than Martin Hollis, but I'm trusting him, not anonymous random flop counters on the intertoobz.
That article (the Extreme Tech one) was written by someone who has no idea on what the fuck he's talking about. There's no backwards compatibility because they literally use entirely different architecture. The PS4 has a shit load of memory bandwidth, has three times the GPU clock speed, has 8 ACE units (the same as Volcanic Islands class GPUs like the R290/290x), the system obliterates the PS3 RAM wise, and smokes the PS3 when it comes to ROPs and texture mapping units. The CPU is still also better because of the core count (the "beastly" CELL is a glorified vector processor). It's better for integer programming.

To really emphasize how much better the PS4 is, you have to look at other games besides last gen remasters (even GTA V is night and day too). Games that were built for current gen and down ported.























 
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EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
If you're trying to use the eye test to prove "greater than 10x," that's just not going to do you any favors, amigo. Those are all pretty good examples of why the chasm this gen isn't as big as last time. Ain't nobody talking up the current gen's CPUs but you, btw.

Again, I'm trusting the veteran program coder and the people who actually work on console hardware, period.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
If you're trying to use the eye test to prove "greater than 10x," that's just not going to do you any favors, amigo. Those are all pretty good examples of why the chasm this gen isn't as big as last time. Ain't nobody talking up the current gen's CPUs but you, btw.

Again, I'm trusting the veteran program coder and the people who actually work on console hardware, period.
I didn't say the CPU was great (hardly), I just said it was better than the CELL due to integer operations due to the core count. CPU heavy games won't be 60 FPS on PS4, I don't expect them to be. At it's best, we'll see games perform like Borderlands: The Handsome Collection due to the low CPU overhead GNM provides and multi-threading.

Also, that quote about the CPU causing Unity to be 900p is a fucking lie. In strictly CPU bound games, the resolution doesn't do much to affect the framerate. To give two examples: Final Fantasy XIV Online: A Realm Reborn included a native 1080p and native 720p options on PS4, the framerate was practically the same due to the game being CPU bound; when I used a cheat in Postal 2 that allowed me to throw infinite amounts of cats on screen, I destroyed the framerate on my old (now dead) desktop. I lowered the resolution from 1080p to 3DS tier resolutions and the framerate was still running well below 20 FPS with no improvements.
 
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EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
Dude, I don't know how to say it more plainly. I'm trusting the people either actually programming for the hardware in question or who have decades of experience in console hardware (I'll trust Ubi, Hollis, and Geomerics over dude no one has heard of writing op/eds). Period, end of story.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
Dude, I don't know how to say it more plainly. I'm trusting the people either actually programming for the hardware in question or who have decades of experience in console hardware (I'll trust Ubi, Hollis, and Geomerics over dude no one has heard of writing op/eds). Period, end of story.
The thing about companies is that they're not allowed to disclose the hardware due to contractual agreements. You'll learn more by doing what I did (number snooping on various sites that just provide facts as opposed to shit opinion pieces) instead of linking vague interviews.

Also, that Ubi guy was the director for Unity, not a programmer.
 

Juegos

All mods go to heaven.
Moderator
Those image comparisons are perfect examples of what I said: "not that much more powerful", and "games and devs aren't ambitious enough to need that extra horsepower [Ex-Actarus says] the NX needs".
 

EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
The thing about companies is that they're not allowed to disclose the hardware due to contractual agreements. You'll learn more by doing what I did (number snooping on various sites that just provide facts as opposed to shit opinion pieces) instead of linking vague interviews.

Also, that Ubi guy was the director for Unity, not a programmer.
We'd probably hear far less generous praise if they didn't have a contract in place. And linking to interviews with people using the hardware is something I'll take over op/eds of questionable authority. YMMV.
Those image comparisons are perfect examples of what I said: "not that much more powerful", and "games and devs aren't ambitious enough to need that extra horsepower [Ex-Actarus says] the NX needs".
Pretty much.

On the NX, there wouldn't be much point in Nintendo trying to out-spec the competition. Why bother? Third parties? Because that always works out so well for Nintendo. If (still a big if) they've consolidated everything into a set of devices with NX in which they scale their internal development engines low to high (depending on if it's handheld or console), then I imagine they're focused far more on what works for EAD/SPD/Monolith/Retro/Intelligent Systems/NST, with an ear toward what handheld designers want at Capcom, Game Freak, Atlus, Silicon Studio, and indies.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
Those image comparisons are perfect examples of what I said: "not that much more powerful", and "games and devs aren't ambitious enough to need that extra horsepower [Ex-Actarus says] the NX needs".
Dude, Shadow of Mordor is almost a different (read: damn unplayable) game on last generation systems.

If you really think they're not much more powerful, then look at Titanfall too. Before they even implemented textures, Fracture averaged at 5 FPS. Do you know what Bluepoint did to make it playable and avoid a Shadow of Mordor level disaster? They literally reworked the entire codebase, that includes the animations, audio, collision detection, world renderer, stripping the local server, moving the DLL system, stripping grunt spawns in Last Titan Standing, and streamed literally everything that previously wasn't on X1 & PC. To top it all off, they had to dynamically stream textures over 64x64 ones so they wouldn't look N64 tier.

That's not getting to the fact that most, if not all, current generation exclusives couldn't work on last gen systems.
 
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GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
We'd probably hear far less generous praise if they didn't have a contract in place. And linking to interviews with people using the hardware is something I'll take over op/eds of questionable authority. YMMV.
I highly doubt it. I like reading developer interviews too, but only when it's something like the Digital Foundry interviews with 4A Games (how they locked both Metro games at 60 FPS with 1080p using the high/ultra presets on PS4) and Bluepoint.
 

Juegos

All mods go to heaven.
Moderator
That's not getting to the fact that most, if not all, current generation exclusives couldn't work on last gen systems.
You and I just have very different view on "much more powerful" means. So a PS3 version of a game intended for the PS4 has lower texture resolution, lower-quality shadows, less ambient occlusion, lower native resolution, and half the framerate than the latter version. So was Perfect Dark also a slideshow without the N64 Expansion Pak - and it had a lower player counter and an inaccessible single player mode. But that wasn't what we called a "generational leap" back then. The difference between the N64 and GameCube is what I would call "much more powerful". And that's not what we have this generation.

Back to the context in which I made that claim to begin with: The Nintendo NX doesn't have to be much more powerful than than the PS4. Even if it ends up being only as powerful as the PS4 (in other words, as powerful as the Radeon HD6850 I bought in 2010), Nintendo are going to be real gravy with it.
 

Shoulder

Your Resident Beardy Bear
I really don't see this. The PS4 and Xbone aren't all that much more powerful than the PS3 and X360, and devs are happy making games with those limitations in mind. It's not like devs are being held back all that much by the current hardware, certainly not in two years from now. Games and developers aren't ambitious enough to require that extra horsepower you think the NX needs. Nintendo least of them all.
The thing about both the PS4 and Xbone is they are really just mid-range PCs when is all said and done. The GPUs are powerful for what they provide, and they have plenty of ram for now, given the way how the systems are built, but the CPU is a mobile CPU in the end. Despite it's 8-core design, it won't run circles around any Core i5, or i7. Hell, I think even a Dual-Core i3 is more powerful than the Jaguar CPU in the PS4 and Xbone, but don't know for sure.

That being said, it is always the case where you can get more out of a console versus a Gaming PC, because the specs are the same for everyone else, versus a general range in the case for PC.

You and I just have very different view on "much more powerful" means. So a PS3 version of a game intended for the PS4 has lower texture resolution, lower-quality shadows, less ambient occlusion, lower native resolution, and half the framerate than the latter version. So was Perfect Dark also a slideshow without the N64 Expansion Pak - and it had a lower player counter and an inaccessible single player mode. But that wasn't what we called a "generational leap" back then. The difference between the N64 and GameCube is what I would call "much more powerful". And that's not what we have this generation.

Back to the context in which I made that claim to begin with: The Nintendo NX doesn't have to be much more powerful than than the PS4. Even if it ends up being only as powerful as the PS4 (in other words, as powerful as the Radeon HD6850 I bought in 2010), Nintendo are going to be real gravy with it.
And here's another thing: That 10x more powerful claim for the PS4 is only in theoretical terms. Remember that first off, some of the CPU cores are locked out from developers, and a good chunk of ram has also been dedicated to the system's OS (Yes, more will be allowed to devs as time moves on). If you take the full specs of the systems, in theory, they should be around 10 or so times more powerful, but in practical terms, it'll be around 5x, and maybe up to 8x when is all said and done.

But specs only tell part of the story. As I've stated before, developers use smoke and mirrors all the time, so it'll appear the games look more impressive than they really are (Nintendo does this too). Developers for the 8th gen twins are already experiencing this, so they have to adapt to the hardware, to try and ink more juice out of it. It's all about dat optimization. Some developers are simply better than others at handling it. In the case of Metro Redux, 4A Games were simply better at handling all the effects at 1080p60 than others, but even so they still had to disable certain effects to maintain that 60fps target.

One last example is GTAV on the PS3 and 360. It's a technical marvel on those systems, and yet R* were also just that good at optimization, it's no reason the games looked and performed as well as they did. But then we get into GTAV on PS4 and X1, and sure the framebuffer is now 1080p instead of 720p, and the graphics have been touched up, but the framerate is still the same (and more stable), and not that magical 60fps that some people were hoping for.
 

Odo

Well-Known Member
Small NX (handheld) and big NX (home) must get the same CPU inside, because Nintendo wants to deliver the same OS for both. The easiest way to do that is developing it for one CPU architecture.

ARM is the way to go in my opinion, it's becoming more powerful every year and it fits hand-held and home consoles.

Also we need to remember the future is cloud computing. Once Nintendo starts processing its games on the cloud, x86 will be done. It's about time to Nintendo kick off its cloud services.
 

EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
I highly doubt it. I like reading developer interviews too, but only when it's something like the Digital Foundry interviews with 4A Games (how they locked both Metro games at 60 FPS with 1080p using the high/ultra presets on PS4) and Bluepoint.
Only when it agrees with your POV, then. Got 'cha. :p
You and I just have very different view on "much more powerful" means. So a PS3 version of a game intended for the PS4 has lower texture resolution, lower-quality shadows, less ambient occlusion, lower native resolution, and half the framerate than the latter version. So was Perfect Dark also a slideshow without the N64 Expansion Pak - and it had a lower player counter and an inaccessible single player mode. But that wasn't what we called a "generational leap" back then. The difference between the N64 and GameCube is what I would call "much more powerful". And that's not what we have this generation.
This sorta reminds me of talking to indy long ago about the power of the Wii. Sure, it was more capable than the GC. Much more capable, depending on the particular task and how you look at it, and that was useful to understand because of there being so many lazy devs who didn't truly utilize the console back then. But in the grand scheme of things, it was a modest bump. The PS4/Bone offer a more appreciable bump, but it ain't a huge one.
And here's another thing: That 10x more powerful claim for the PS4 is only in theoretical terms. Remember that first off, some of the CPU cores are locked out from developers, and a good chunk of ram has also been dedicated to the system's OS (Yes, more will be allowed to devs as time moves on). If you take the full specs of the systems, in theory, they should be around 10 or so times more powerful, but in practical terms, it'll be around 5x, and maybe up to 8x when is all said and done.
Well, as @Goodtwin has mentioned many times, resolution ain't cheap (and is almost never accounted for in the theoretical power navel gazing). But this also gets into how useless benchmark scores are, how fruitless it is to compare machines that aren't that alike, and how silly console makers can be with their spec boasting (remember when Sony said the PS2 could push 75 million polys per second - a useless figure that included no effects and was a non-game environment boast?).
Back to the context in which I made that claim to begin with: The Nintendo NX doesn't have to be much more powerful than than the PS4. Even if it ends up being only as powerful as the PS4 (in other words, as powerful as the Radeon HD6850 I bought in 2010), Nintendo are going to be real gravy with it.
Precisely. Look at what they're doing with the Wii U now. Hell, look at what they've done on the 3DS. Nintendo wants accessible power, not outright headroom (and their strength as software designers is plugged into them knowing the hardware front to back). If the NX we see introduced next is a handheld, making it as powerful as a PS4 would introduce all sorts of heat dissipation issues and battery life problems. Honestly, jamming in a modified Wii U design into handheld form with an ARM CPU and keeping the price acceptably low would be an achievement for them.
 
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EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
I'm not sure if you're being facetious or not. If it's not from someone working on the hardware, it's guesswork. "I posted it on the internet and some people have read it" is not a reliable source in any capacity (it's how people started using GAF as a source to begin with). Again, you can trust it if you like. Ain't no way I am.

Meanwhile, back in NX land...
 

Ex-Actarus

Well-Known Member
Small NX (handheld) and big NX (home) must get the same CPU inside, because Nintendo wants to deliver the same OS for both. The easiest way to do that is developing it for one CPU architecture.

ARM is the way to go in my opinion, it's becoming more powerful every year and it fits hand-held and home consoles.

Also we need to remember the future is cloud computing. Once Nintendo starts processing its games on the cloud, x86 will be done. It's about time to Nintendo kick off its cloud services.
I agree with you @Odo , Cloud is the way to go in the future !

I expect the PS5 and the Xbox Two to be Cloud ONLY console. In my opinion those consoles will arrive 5 years from now so in 2020. Forget about blu ray drive, it won't happen ! Actually, Sony already hinted it will be the case :

"I think there will be a PS5. However, I don’t know what form it’ll have. It could be a physical console, or it could be in the cloud"

Sony acquired Gakai for half a billion dollar... They won't make the money back just with the PlayStation Now service. This is long term strategy for Cloud Only videogames services. They've just acquired Onlive technology as well, so this confirms that long term vision.

Microsoft, on the other hand, has already the infrastructure in place with Microsoft Azure. They are making enormous amount of money with their Cloud solutions right now, especially Office 365, their fastest growing business these days ( 30% growth ). Besides, a Cloud console would ultimately enable them to accomplish their original vision for the Xbox One... Yes "Always Online" that's pretty much the definition of Cloud guys !

Nintendo ? I don't think so. I think NX will have some Cloud features, probably something similar to PlayStation Now. But forget about Nintendo having a console designed around a Cloud infrastructure. They are still trailing the competition with their online offering, I can't imagine them going for Cloud strategy this early. No way ! So I don't expect an ARM processor for both consoles ( handheld and home console ). Again, I'm very concerned about the power of the console, and not sure ARM can deliver on that front for a home console.


Source : http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/12...ow-if-itll-be-physical-of-based-on-the-cloud/


Source 2 : http://ie.ign.com/articles/2015/04/...aming-tech-from-game-streaming-service-onlive
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure if you're being facetious or not. If it's not from someone working on the hardware, it's guesswork. "I posted it on the internet and some people have read it" is not a reliable source in any capacity (it's how people started using GAF as a source to begin with). Again, you can trust it if you like. Ain't no way I am.

Meanwhile, back in NX land...
Well the Bluepoint interview actually focuses on how they downported Titanfall to the 360, and the 4A interview is also just an objective look on how they work with the hardware.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/d...its-really-like-to-make-a-multi-platform-game

I like these articles because they're insightful. It has nothing to do with opinions.
 
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EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
There isn't one thing in there that even comes close to comfirming what you're trying to falsify. But seriously, I'mma start moving posts to a PS4 thread at this rate.
 

Goodtwin

Well-Known Member
Seeing as how I believe the NX will be just as much a successor to the 3DS as it is the Wii U, I dont see being on par or far exceeding the PS4 and X1 as being all that relevant. If you look at how successful the 3DS is, a portable that launched in an era where mobile gaming was certainly a thing, and Sony had a dedicated portable that featured far superior tech, I think it proves this is an arena Nintendo can continue to thrive in. So instead of looking at the NX as a home console that can also be played as a portable, think about it as a portable than can now be played on your TV. It instantly adds value that no other product really offers (or markets). Now every single Nintendo produced game is available for their device,no more splitting up game development for two separate platforms. Nintendo cant support a platform on their own, but if its one instead of two, they can certainly do a much better job of it. Not to mention third party support on the 3DS has been just fine, and coupled with better than ever Indie support, they can support a platform even if some third party publishers shun it. So with all that said, I dont see the first incarnation of NX being that much more capable than the Wii U, and believe some late Wii U games will ultimately release on both the NX and Wii U. I say first incarnation, because I believe Nintendo will revise their hardware every few years from now on. Just like the DS went through multiple revisions, I see this happening with NX, Nintendo is simply laying down the foundation for all future hardware. Basically, choosing a hardware philosophy for the next 10 years, so that all Nintendo content is accessible on all hardware they offer.
 

Odo

Well-Known Member
That strategy didn't really pay off, so maybe this time they should care, because devs and gamers do care !
Wii U situation may have convinced them about it. Plus, we're living in a age of hardware specs maniacs. People are obsessed about their phones and tablets CPU and memory specs.

However, I think Iwata still keeps his Wii/DS/3DS mindset.
 

mattavelle1

IT’S GOT A DEATH RAY!
Moderator
Wii U situation may have convinced them about it. Plus, we're living in a age of hardware specs maniacs. People are obsessed about their phones and tablets CPU and memory specs.

However, I think Iwata still keeps his Wii/DS/3DS mindset.
Very much agree with this.
 

Ex-Actarus

Well-Known Member
Wii U situation may have convinced them about it. Plus, we're living in a age of hardware specs maniacs. People are obsessed about their phones and tablets CPU and memory specs.

However, I think Iwata still keeps his Wii/DS/3DS mindset.
Look what happened with the Wii U when it came 1 year ahead of the PS4 and Xbox One. It could have been the FIRST real next gen console ( talking about power only here, ok ? I know it's a next gen console ) ! Instead, what we got ? Ports of 360/PS3 games and bad ones ! We had also few exclusives titles, but they weren't really pushing the system ( I think we ALL agree that NSMBU and Nintendoland weren't graphical powerhouse... ). So gamers didn't have any incentives to buy a Wii U. With the Xbox One and PS4, we had games as Ryse or Killzone Shadow Fall. Ok, those weren't GOTY titles, but they looked well ahead visually than the other current gen titles.

With NX, Nintendo needs a graphical darling. That's Marketing we're talking about here... We need a title that will sell the console just for the graphics as Ryse and Killzone Shadow Fall did. Don't come - again - with sub PS4/Xbone ports and not that impressive launch titles. Could Zelda U look even better on NX ? I really believe so. Imagine a Zelda Wii U 1080p and 60 fps ? I know for us it's not a big deal, we will play the game anyway at sub 30 fps and sub 720p ; but in this Digital Foundry era, it matters !!!

So I'm expecting a very powerful home console from Nintendo ( at least 3 or 4 times more powerful than the PS4 ). Again, if it's a handheld ( with streaming features a la Nvidia Shield ), expect Wii U power, which is pretty great for handheld IMO.
 
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EvilTw1n

Even my henchmen think I'm crazy.
Moderator
Plus, we're living in a age of hardware specs maniacs. People are obsessed about their phones and tablets CPU and memory specs.
Well, yes and no.

Easy-to-market specs? Sure. "Full HD" or "retina display" or the like are easy to market, and people come around to wanting the next big thing.

But harder to market specs? Not as easy. Just look at the iPhone. If the absolute latest and greatest tech is what you want, you go Android (more phone producers pushing more ideas and delivering innovation at a quicker pace). But Apple kept its marketshare, despite not having the latest whiz-bang tech. And even when they upgrade, they are careful with what they include. The iPhone 6 is not a spec monster - it basically has the specs of a 2012 phone. But it had one feature consumers wanted (bigger screen), and people went nuts for it. Meanwhile, Samsung is getting back on the horse, but the Galaxy S6 isn't selling because it's the most powerhouse phone money can buy - it's because they hyped up its new, non-plastic design (the S5 was a very powerful phone, but some people got tired of its construction). So it ain't all internal, computational specs.

Outside of 4K (which is going to be technologically cost-prohibitive for awhile), there is no huge marketing buzzword you can place out there for video game machines. The average consumer doesn't care about tessellation. And the average gamer probably ain't looking at Nintendo for super premium specs (who do you know who bought a GC over a PS2, or a Wii U over a 360, because of hardware power alone?).

So with the NX, Nintendo really has two targets:

1) Deliver an easy to market feature.

2) Get the damn name right. Apple never needs to generate hype for a new iPhone, because everyone knows the next release by looking at the name of the thing. Same with the PlayStation. Same with the Samsung Galaxy phones. Nintendo royally screwed up the Wii brand name, and it's probably time to retire it.

[And it should go without saying that they need to deliver a killer app on day one, but because it's Nintendo, we gotta underline that point, like Ex said.]
 

Odo

Well-Known Member
Apple's power machine is iPad. It's a monster and every year more CPU heavy ios apps come out and Apple has to release another power monster. Mac Pro is another monster.

I'm still not sure that power and specs are crucial, but it's a big deal today, much more than 10 years ago when people had no idea about their devices' CPU/RAM.
 

GaemzDood

Well-Known Member
The thing about both the PS4 and Xbone is they are really just mid-range PCs when is all said and done. The GPUs are powerful for what they provide, and they have plenty of ram for now, given the way how the systems are built, but the CPU is a mobile CPU in the end. Despite it's 8-core design, it won't run circles around any Core i5, or i7. Hell, I think even a Dual-Core i3 is more powerful than the Jaguar CPU in the PS4 and Xbone, but don't know for sure.

That being said, it is always the case where you can get more out of a console versus a Gaming PC, because the specs are the same for everyone else, versus a general range in the case for PC.



And here's another thing: That 10x more powerful claim for the PS4 is only in theoretical terms. Remember that first off, some of the CPU cores are locked out from developers, and a good chunk of ram has also been dedicated to the system's OS (Yes, more will be allowed to devs as time moves on). If you take the full specs of the systems, in theory, they should be around 10 or so times more powerful, but in practical terms, it'll be around 5x, and maybe up to 8x when is all said and done.

But specs only tell part of the story. As I've stated before, developers use smoke and mirrors all the time, so it'll appear the games look more impressive than they really are (Nintendo does this too). Developers for the 8th gen twins are already experiencing this, so they have to adapt to the hardware, to try and ink more juice out of it. It's all about dat optimization. Some developers are simply better than others at handling it. In the case of Metro Redux, 4A Games were simply better at handling all the effects at 1080p60 than others, but even so they still had to disable certain effects to maintain that 60fps target.

One last example is GTAV on the PS3 and 360. It's a technical marvel on those systems, and yet R* were also just that good at optimization, it's no reason the games looked and performed as well as they did. But then we get into GTAV on PS4 and X1, and sure the framebuffer is now 1080p instead of 720p, and the graphics have been touched up, but the framerate is still the same (and more stable), and not that magical 60fps that some people were hoping for.
Well yeah, it's CPU bound. As for Metro Redux, there weren't many things that were disabled at all. Aside from tessellation, motion blur, some specular reflections, and some volumetric lights (dunno even know why for this one considering Wolfenstein & both CoDs have plenty, and Metro even has some volumetric lights in other areas), everything's there.

The CPU thing is really a nontroversey, because like I said, the GNM API provides a low CPU overhead. Kingdom Come: Deliverance's developers have no problems with it for instance.
 
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Well, yes and no.

Easy-to-market specs? Sure. "Full HD" or "retina display" or the like are easy to market, and people come around to wanting the next big thing.

But harder to market specs? Not as easy. Just look at the iPhone. If the absolute latest and greatest tech is what you want, you go Android (more phone producers pushing more ideas and delivering innovation at a quicker pace). But Apple kept its marketshare, despite not having the latest whiz-bang tech. And even when they upgrade, they are careful with what they include. The iPhone 6 is not a spec monster - it basically has the specs of a 2012 phone. But it had one feature consumers wanted (bigger screen), and people went nuts for it. Meanwhile, Samsung is getting back on the horse, but the Galaxy S6 isn't selling because it's the most powerhouse phone money can buy - it's because they hyped up its new, non-plastic design (the S5 was a very powerful phone, but some people got tired of its construction). So it ain't all internal, computational specs.

Outside of 4K (which is going to be technologically cost-prohibitive for awhile), there is no huge marketing buzzword you can place out there for video game machines. The average consumer doesn't care about tessellation. And the average gamer probably ain't looking at Nintendo for super premium specs (who do you know who bought a GC over a PS2, or a Wii U over a 360, because of hardware power alone?).

So with the NX, Nintendo really has two targets:

1) Deliver an easy to market feature.

2) Get the damn name right. Apple never needs to generate hype for a new iPhone, because everyone knows the next release by looking at the name of the thing. Same with the PlayStation. Same with the Samsung Galaxy phones. Nintendo royally screwed up the Wii brand name, and it's probably time to retire it.

[And it should go without saying that they need to deliver a killer app on day one, but because it's Nintendo, we gotta underline that point, like Ex said.]
Well, if the NX needs to Launch with a Killer App, I vote for the next Metroid from Retro Studios. They could even go so far as to have Felicia Day play Samus with Real time Footage thrown in.

Maybe call it the Nintendo XLarge Unit. Or what would be better than Super??? I'm sure they're working on the perfect name.

As for now, I'm waiting for the Xenoblade Chronicles X Direct on 4/24 at 2:00 pm EST. Maybe Nintendo will give us the Release Date for the game. Better yet, have it Release during E3 Days (June 16-19).
 

Shoulder

Your Resident Beardy Bear
Well, if the NX needs to Launch with a Killer App, I vote for the next Metroid from Retro Studios. They could even go so far as to have Felicia Day play Samus with Real time Footage thrown in.

Maybe call it the Nintendo XLarge Unit. Or what would be better than Super??? I'm sure they're working on the perfect name.

As for now, I'm waiting for the Xenoblade Chronicles X Direct on 4/24 at 2:00 pm EST. Maybe Nintendo will give us the Release Date for the game. Better yet, have it Release during E3 Days (June 16-19).
They should call it the Nintendo Big McLargeHuge.
 

Ex-Actarus

Well-Known Member
According to Nikkei, The NX will have a Android OS.

That's quite a development ! That means that Nintendo finally realized that they need to rely on specialist on specific features they don't master. OS is clearly one of them, Nintendo hardwares have never been praised for their OS.

Another area is online and we learned earlier this year, that Nintendo is going to use the expertise of DENA on the matter.

I really LOVE this new Nintendo who is thinking outside the box ( and outside Nintendo ).


Source : http://ie.ign.com/articles/2015/06/01/report-nintendos-codename-nx-platform-will-be-android-based
 
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